Tolkien Gateway

Tolkien Gateway:Meetings/7 August 2011/Transcript

[2011-08-07 20:01:02] <KingAragorn> Welcome to this month's meeting of Tolkien Gateway contributors. Ederchil, KingAragorn, Hyarion, Mith, and Morgan are all present.
[2011-08-07 20:01:28] <Mith> I'm looking forward to a meeting of super efficiency.
[2011-08-07 20:01:51] <KingAragorn> Shall we postpone Amroth's first idea for the agenda?
[2011-08-07 20:01:51] <Ederchil> What makes you think that'll happen?
[2011-08-07 20:01:59] <Ederchil> Sure.
[2011-08-07 20:02:25] <KingAragorn> OK, Mith: "Do we need to do redirecting secondary names again?"
[2011-08-07 20:02:39] <Mith> Do we?
[2011-08-07 20:02:45] <Mith> It was a tie last time
[2011-08-07 20:02:49] <Mith> The vote.
[2011-08-07 20:03:22] <KingAragorn> Is it fair to make a decision with so few present?
[2011-08-07 20:03:28] <Morgan> No
[2011-08-07 20:03:50] <Ederchil> Maybe allow people to cast their vote somewhere on the wiki?
[2011-08-07 20:04:09] <Mith> Well, the only person missing last time was Ederchil
[2011-08-07 20:04:11] <KingAragorn> Good idea, we'll make good use of the fresh looking forums
[2011-08-07 20:05:05] <KingAragorn> All agreed?
[2011-08-07 20:05:09] <Morgan> yep
[2011-08-07 20:05:15] <Ederchil> yes
[2011-08-07 20:05:46] <Mith> Suppose so
[2011-08-07 20:05:49] <KingAragorn> OK, Ederchil: "I'm not sure if this was discusses as part of the Quin/Vector discussion, but should we even have articles about non-licensed games, especially if it's just a copy of Tolkien Games?"
[2011-08-07 20:06:20] <Morgan> It was discussed. I didn't think so. Everybody else thought they should be on TG.
[2011-08-07 20:06:33] <Ederchil> I agree with Morgan.
[2011-08-07 20:06:39] <KingAragorn> I think we agreed that we should have articles on non-licensed games, but that making articles about their authors was not really necessary.
[2011-08-07 20:06:45] <Morgan> Still a minority ;-)
[2011-08-07 20:07:12] <Ederchil> So many of them are just text adventures made by highschoolers and played by, what, 5 people?
[2011-08-07 20:07:58] <KingAragorn> I don't think we should uniformly remove and ban the inclusion of all non-licensed games
[2011-08-07 20:08:10] <Mith> I don't know if we can quantify that.
[2011-08-07 20:08:31] <Morgan> How do you mean, Mith?
[2011-08-07 20:08:40] <Mith> Then only 5 people play them
[2011-08-07 20:08:51] <Mith> One of them has a Facebook app which loads of people play
[2011-08-07 20:09:18] <Morgan> +1 KA, we should have a guideline for when a game is considered to be noteworthy
[2011-08-07 20:09:23] <Mith> How do we know whether they're worth keeping unless we know who's playing them? Which we can't know.
[2011-08-07 20:09:38] <Morgan> For example, a very popular Facebook game could be considered noteworthy, I'd say
[2011-08-07 20:09:59] <Mith> Some of the official games in the 80s had barely any players
[2011-08-07 20:10:04] <Morgan> Or any "published" game, which came with a box, etc
[2011-08-07 20:10:09] <Ederchil> A lot of them even Tolkien Games hasn't played.
[2011-08-07 20:10:36] <Morgan> The "license" doesn't have to be the red line
[2011-08-07 20:10:59] <KingAragorn> We can judge these matters on a case by case basis
[2011-08-07 20:11:00] <Mith> I feel a little uneasy making a decision without Amroth
[2011-08-07 20:11:09] <Morgan> Yeah, agree with Mith
[2011-08-07 20:11:11] <Ederchil> True.
[2011-08-07 20:11:23] <KingAragorn> OK, another one for the forums?
[2011-08-07 20:11:27] <Mith> If we have a case-by-case rule then it's no rule at all
[2011-08-07 20:11:29] <Ederchil> I would say we get rid of creator articles, though. They're just names.
[2011-08-07 20:11:39] <Mith> I would agree with that
[2011-08-07 20:11:46] <Morgan> Amroth has kind of standard, right?
[2011-08-07 20:12:03] <Morgan> If the guy/girl has made more than 2 games, then it gets a page?
[2011-08-07 20:13:11] <Ederchil> if a company has more than 2 games, then yes.
[2011-08-07 20:13:40] <Morgan> I kind of remember he said something similar for game creators, nevermind
[2011-08-07 20:13:46] <Morgan> -> forum
[2011-08-07 20:13:52] <Ederchil> yes
[2011-08-07 20:14:07] <Mith> I think this is one of those area we've "grown" into
[2011-08-07 20:14:36] <Mith> We didn't have much on games before and we now realise better what to have and not to have
[2011-08-07 20:14:57] <Morgan> true, there's not any hurry in deciding these matters
[2011-08-07 20:15:10] <KingAragorn> OK, next was Amroth's discussion point about a languages portal.
[2011-08-07 20:15:25] <Ederchil> he wasn't very specific...
[2011-08-07 20:15:33] <KingAragorn> Yeah
[2011-08-07 20:15:48] <KingAragorn> But me and Morgan have discussed it before
[2011-08-07 20:16:21] <KingAragorn> I'd like to implement Morgan's dictionary project into it
[2011-08-07 20:16:26] <Morgan> Someone didn't want me to work on linguistic stuff on TG...
[2011-08-07 20:16:45] <Mith> Well, it's difficult to know where to go with this as we don't know what he wants to discuss.
[2011-08-07 20:16:46] <Morgan> So there's a hiatus with the dict project
[2011-08-07 20:16:57] <KingAragorn> Oh
[2011-08-07 20:17:07] <KingAragorn> One more to postpone then?
[2011-08-07 20:17:22] <Morgan> sure
[2011-08-07 20:18:48] <KingAragorn> I guess, all present know the status regarding beta and the upgrade today. For the record today we upgraded to MediaWiki 1.17
[2011-08-07 20:19:04] <KingAragorn> And implemented the new Mithilien skin
[2011-08-07 20:19:16] <KingAragorn> I'd like to thank Mith and Hyarion for their work in this area
[2011-08-07 20:19:43] <KingAragorn> I'm sure others would too
[2011-08-07 20:19:57] <Ederchil> Yeah, looks great.
[2011-08-07 20:20:09] <Ederchil> Search suggest ftw.
[2011-08-07 20:21:13] <KingAragorn> OK, next is a discussion on file licensing templates. What does everyone think? http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Tolkien_Gateway:File_licensing_templates
[2011-08-07 20:21:40] <KingAragorn> I'd like to roll these out, sorting out all images
[2011-08-07 20:21:56] <KingAragorn> And wherever possible we should get written permission from artists
[2011-08-07 20:22:01] <Morgan> It looks very good to me, KA
[2011-08-07 20:22:17] <Ederchil> we need some standard for the current fairuse templates too
[2011-08-07 20:22:52] <KingAragorn> The idea is that we'd stop using multiple templates for fairuse
[2011-08-07 20:23:24] <KingAragorn> And I'm quite happy with the new fairuse template
[2011-08-07 20:23:35] <Mith> One thing
[2011-08-07 20:23:53] <KingAragorn> Should we get rid of Tolkien Gateway:Fair use and put that information into Tolkien Gateway:Copyrights?
[2011-08-07 20:24:11] <Mith> If something is PD or GNU or whatever, how do we prove it?
[2011-08-07 20:24:52] <KingAragorn> I don't think it would be necessary
[2011-08-07 20:25:12] <KingAragorn> We'd be relying on the integrity and honesty of the person who applies the template
[2011-08-07 20:25:49] <KingAragorn> If you want proof you can just ask the person
[2011-08-07 20:26:11] <Mith> So, no link to the original?
[2011-08-07 20:26:31] <KingAragorn> Not necessary
[2011-08-07 20:26:48] <Ederchil> why not?
[2011-08-07 20:27:24] <KingAragorn> If you want to you can, but it doesn't need to be with the licence
[2011-08-07 20:30:22] <KingAragorn> Any more queries?
[2011-08-07 20:30:32] <Ederchil> nope.
[2011-08-07 20:31:25] <Morgan> no
[2011-08-07 20:31:25] <KingAragorn> OK, should we remove inactive supervisors?
[2011-08-07 20:31:34] <Mith> Yes
[2011-08-07 20:31:37] <Ederchil> Probably send an email first
[2011-08-07 20:31:56] <KingAragorn> I'm sure we agreed at a previous meeting that we will remove them if they are inactive
[2011-08-07 20:32:10] <KingAragorn> "Please note: as per Tolkien Gateway's twelfth meeting, inactive supervisors will be replaced if necessary. "
[2011-08-07 20:32:11] <Mith> Mthomas is unemabilable
[2011-08-07 20:32:34] <Ederchil> okay, then it's clear.
[2011-08-07 20:33:07] <Morgan> np with me
[2011-08-07 20:33:09] <KingAragorn> So, we're removing Morgan, Dr Death, Ælfwine, and Mthomas
[2011-08-07 20:33:20] <Ederchil> Morgan too?
[2011-08-07 20:33:30] <KingAragorn> Yeah, haven't seen him in ages
[2011-08-07 20:33:36] <Mith> He's awful
[2011-08-07 20:34:14] <Ederchil> Okay with me.
[2011-08-07 20:34:39] <KingAragorn> OK, are there any additional discussions that we could have now?
[2011-08-07 20:35:08] <Ederchil> Yes, I thought of one
[2011-08-07 20:35:29] <Ederchil> Someone made a category "German users" last week.
[2011-08-07 20:35:52] <KingAragorn> Hurin Thalio
[2011-08-07 20:35:54] <Ederchil> Should this be changed to German Gatekeepers, and should we do it for all countries?
[2011-08-07 20:35:54] <KingAragorn> n
[2011-08-07 20:36:22] <Ederchil> I have no objections to it
[2011-08-07 20:36:51] <Morgan> Was the name "Gatekeepers" here from the beginning?
[2011-08-07 20:36:59] <KingAragorn> http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Category:Gatekeepers_by_nationality
[2011-08-07 20:37:06] <KingAragorn> All use users
[2011-08-07 20:37:29] <Ederchil> true, but they were created after Hurin did his.
[2011-08-07 20:37:30] <Morgan> It's a bit unecessarily jargonistic, tbh
[2011-08-07 20:37:32] <KingAragorn> Is it necessary anyway?
[2011-08-07 20:37:38] <KingAragorn> Do we need these categories?
[2011-08-07 20:37:50] <Ederchil> Should we even use the word Gatekeeper?
[2011-08-07 20:37:57] <Mith> I like the word Gatekeeper
[2011-08-07 20:38:11] <Morgan> I prefer "user"
[2011-08-07 20:38:58] <KingAragorn> Category:Gatekeepers_by_nationality should be in Category:Gatekeepers anyway
[2011-08-07 20:39:08] <Morgan> KA, to me, it's a bit like why have "Category:Gatekeepers by web browser"?
[2011-08-07 20:39:09] <Morgan> and similar
[2011-08-07 20:39:11] <KingAragorn> And it needs fleshing out if it's to be of any use
[2011-08-07 20:39:25] <KingAragorn> Well, they're from userboxes
[2011-08-07 20:39:51] <KingAragorn> I don't think Category:Gatekeepers_by_nationality is
[2011-08-07 20:39:53] <Mith> It's useful for when people complaing about an error in thei skin
[2011-08-07 20:40:09] <Mith> Then I can know what browser they use
[2011-08-07 20:40:13] <Morgan> or "Category:Gatekeepers by knowledge", which must be one of the strangest we have
[2011-08-07 20:40:42] <Mith> Again, it's useful to know how people rate themselves
[2011-08-07 20:41:05] <KingAragorn> http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Category:User_lore-4 <-- everyone's scared of this one
[2011-08-07 20:41:17] <Morgan> Why is it useful?
[2011-08-07 20:41:20] <Ederchil> everyone's just modest
[2011-08-07 20:41:42] <Morgan> yeah, that's why I removed that cat, it's just silly
[2011-08-07 20:42:06] <Mith> Everyone is just modest. :p
[2011-08-07 20:42:35] <KingAragorn> I think we should remove Category:Gatekeeper by nationality and keep the rest and they're used by userboxes
[2011-08-07 20:42:57] <Ederchil> or we need userboxes for nationality ;0
[2011-08-07 20:42:57] <KingAragorn> *as they're
[2011-08-07 20:43:03] <KingAragorn> We could do!
[2011-08-07 20:43:21] <Mith> I could fly the Saltire then!
[2011-08-07 20:43:28] <KingAragorn> But if we don't, these should be removed
[2011-08-07 20:43:52] <Ederchil> yes
[2011-08-07 20:44:07] <KingAragorn> I'll fly the red dragon
[2011-08-07 20:44:29] <KingAragorn> But
[2011-08-07 20:44:38] <KingAragorn> We shouldn't diffuse the UK
[2011-08-07 20:44:46] <KingAragorn> One flag for all
[2011-08-07 20:45:31] <KingAragorn> Amroth and Ederchil can use this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Flag_North-Holland,_Netherlands.svg
[2011-08-07 20:46:00] <Mith> Well, KingAragorn
[2011-08-07 20:46:15] <Mith> If it is "Gatekeepers by nationality", then we *should* diffuse the UK
[2011-08-07 20:46:20] <Ederchil> I prefer this one http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Flag_of_Groningen.svg
[2011-08-07 20:46:53] <Ederchil> or this one even http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:VlagWinsum.svg
[2011-08-07 20:46:54] <KingAragorn> Perhaps!
[2011-08-07 20:47:02] <KingAragorn> Errr Groningen province!
[2011-08-07 20:48:00] <KingAragorn> OK, are we agreeing to expand Gatekeeps by nationality by making userboxes for it?
[2011-08-07 20:48:20] <Ederchil> yes
[2011-08-07 20:48:40] <Morgan> don't have any opinion
[2011-08-07 20:49:02] <KingAragorn> I think we should
[2011-08-07 20:50:19] <KingAragorn> Should I be the Images Supervisor?
[2011-08-07 20:50:34] <Ederchil> You seem perfect for it
[2011-08-07 20:51:04] <Morgan> indeed
[2011-08-07 20:51:10] <KingAragorn> When is my coronation?
[2011-08-07 20:51:26] <Morgan> you don't get any f**king coronation, that's just how it is
[2011-08-07 20:51:32] <Mith> ROFL
[2011-08-07 20:51:38] * KingAragorn cries
[2011-08-07 20:52:00] <Mith> Ederchil, Morgan has theserude sweary fits every now and then
[2011-08-07 20:52:14] <Ederchil> I noticed.
[2011-08-07 20:52:30] <KingAragorn> It's all going in the transcript!
[2011-08-07 20:52:42] <KingAragorn> Is there anything else before adjournment?
[2011-08-07 20:52:59] <Ederchil> can't think of anything
[2011-08-07 20:53:05] <Morgan> bump!
[2011-08-07 20:53:48] <KingAragorn> Bump?
[2011-08-07 20:54:06] <Morgan> to Ederchil
[2011-08-07 20:54:21] <Ederchil> Bump what?
[2011-08-07 20:54:34] <KingAragorn> OK, meeting adjourned.